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Raiding Ironforge
https://w.yarrthepirate.com/phpbb3/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=2717		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Atmosphere [ Sun Dec 26, 2004 12:27 am ]
Post subject:  Raiding Ironforge
I haven't raided IF or see it done, but as I was walking through it i realised that it would take a substantional force to do that. More than 40 people I would think, and cant the players also jump in regardless of PvP or PvE?
Have any of you seen a raid on the bigger cities yet? If so, was is as nuts as I dream it would be?
Author:  Ponuh [ Sun Dec 26, 2004 12:32 am ]
Post subject: 
Well

By going to a PvE server you didn't really sign up for things like that
Author:  Atmosphere [ Sun Dec 26, 2004 12:42 am ]
Post subject: 
Hmmmm. . . so there are no quests to kill people in the cities? Not even to kill thrall or something?
Author:  Ponuh [ Sun Dec 26, 2004 12:57 am ]
Post subject: 
hehe, if you wanted to play against other players, you are certainly on the wrong server
Author:  Tooyooo [ Sun Dec 26, 2004 8:37 am ]
Post subject: 
Yeah, just ignore ponuh.... I think he's just bitter that he keeps getting ganked or something.


PvE servers have plenty of organized PvP on them.... and raiding a main city does happen. Its not a matter of people no doing anything, its just like you said, not enouhg high lvl organization to really do anything ot a city like Ironforge.

And yeah, you would need quite a few 60~s since any time you raid a city the visible guards aren't the real problem... its the guards that spawn when u kill any important NPC (like a vendor or quest NPC).

There are no quests that I am aware of to kill main Horde or Alliance NPCs.

There are quests that may involve the killing of an NPC that will enable pvp on u. (on pve servers).

And even on PvP servers, there are no "rewards" yet for PvP...so ppl do it purely for entertainment.... as on PvE servers.

Ponuh clearly hasn't played on a PvE server.
Author:  Atmosphere [ Sun Dec 26, 2004 12:37 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hmm yeah thats what I was thinking tooyoo. Cause I have toons on both PvP and PvE servers, and i thought raiding big cites would be something everyone wanted to do. Not to kill PLayers, but I would love to run into Thrall's throne room to see what he and his pals can throw at us.

And i forgot about the other npcs who spawn, like when Crossroads was raided the windmaster had like 5 angry wyvrens swarm about him. Just think of the possibilities. . . well i gotta go take a cold shower now.
Author:  Ponuh [ Sun Dec 26, 2004 8:32 pm ]
Post subject: 
Tooyoo--

So you decided not to go to a "Player versus Player" server, and now YOU guys are looking to see if you can raid Ironforge.

Getting ganked is actually really fun. If I didn't ever get ganked, the game would just be WAY too easy.
Author:  Karta [ Sun Dec 26, 2004 10:46 pm ]
Post subject: 
ganking is fun? ponuh what drugs do you take while you play? I want some.
Author:  Ponuh [ Sun Dec 26, 2004 11:03 pm ]
Post subject: 
It is.

It gives you a sense of...well, "difficulty" when you're playing.
Author:  Darksoul [ Sun Dec 26, 2004 11:21 pm ]
Post subject: 
good call ponuh.. id have to add Realism to that too. when you're at war.
PvP is just so much more enthralling.. but ur right.. pve is for the casual gamer. PvP is for hardcore enjoyment.
Author:  Atmosphere [ Mon Dec 27, 2004 12:24 am ]
Post subject: 
PvP To Fuck peoples up, and PvE to beat the game. . . Thats how i see and how I play it too.
Author:  Karta [ Mon Dec 27, 2004 7:51 am ]
Post subject: 
getting ganked is not fun. I don't know what you guys are on, but when a level 60 ganks me in STV, I don't enjoy it to the least. You are right about one thing, it does add difficulty to the zone, but it doesn't make me want to sit there and get ganked over and over.
Author:  Dinav [ Mon Dec 27, 2004 11:58 am ]
Post subject: 
Karta wrote:
getting ganked is not fun. I don't know what you guys are on, but when a level 60 ganks me in STV, I don't enjoy it to the least. You are right about one thing, it does add difficulty to the zone, but it doesn't make me want to sit there and get ganked over and over.


So...don't?

PvE is easy mode. The game is incredibly easy if you ignore the fact that you are at war. The first 5 or so people to hit 60 on every PvP server had it easy, because there was no real PvP threat.

I can also rest assured that I know how to play my rogue better than any rogue of equal level on a PvE server, because I've done much more fighting. People on PvE servers don't use "PvE builds" for their characters, so even if you DO go on a raid, it's like a bunch of really weak guys fighting weak guys.
Author:  Tooyooo [ Mon Dec 27, 2004 1:32 pm ]
Post subject: 
I guess the biggest difference would be the ratios of Rouge vs Hunter in PvP and PvE servers...

I'm sure everyoen in PvP likes to go Rogue b/c going invisible is a nice thing when you can get ganked. And having a pet is great when soloing vs. Environment.

When it comes to organized raids however... they still occur in PvE servers and essentially are the same thing as in PvP, except you don't have Lv 60's killing lvl 1-30's.

Like it has been stated in previous threads and this one several times.... PvP just makes the game more challenging b/c you have to look out for yourself, and in most cases Rogue is a nice class to play for that. And vice versa when it comes to PvE.

I'm sure when servers start getting full of lvl 60's you'll find some organized raids, then people will get bored and even on PvP servers do organized instances just to get better equip.

Because, in all MMORPGs, after lvl cap all that is left is uber equipment.
Author:  Karta [ Mon Dec 27, 2004 3:23 pm ]
Post subject: 
Dinav wrote:
Karta wrote:
getting ganked is not fun. I don't know what you guys are on, but when a level 60 ganks me in STV, I don't enjoy it to the least. You are right about one thing, it does add difficulty to the zone, but it doesn't make me want to sit there and get ganked over and over.


So...don't?

PvE is easy mode. The game is incredibly easy if you ignore the fact that you are at war. The first 5 or so people to hit 60 on every PvP server had it easy, because there was no real PvP threat.

I can also rest assured that I know how to play my rogue better than any rogue of equal level on a PvE server, because I've done much more fighting. People on PvE servers don't use "PvE builds" for their characters, so even if you DO go on a raid, it's like a bunch of really weak guys fighting weak guys.


dinav, he said getting ganked was fun. have you EVER been playing in STV, have a level 50+ shaman while you are only mid 30s attack you, and demolish you in a few strikes? If so, did you think immediately afterwards "BOY, THAT WAS FUN!!!"

I am on tich, which is highly competitive. I take the good with the bad. But ganking...is not what I would call an enjoyable moment.
Author:  Festaru [ Mon Dec 27, 2004 11:52 pm ]
Post subject: 
No one chose a PvE server, and there are no rules that say "you can't pvp because you didn't sign up for it".

It's actually a Normal server, there is still pvp setup in it, and really the only difference is UNorganized pvp, gank or be-ganked.

I think more than half the people who went to normal servers did it because:

1) they wanted to choose when to pvp and when not to, but not to avoid it completely, they want to enjoy the game and mind their own business without a group of 13 year-olds who think they are the l33test because they ph4tpwnzored you when you're 5 levels lower than them and by yourself, all the time.

and 2) the general community is usually more mature when everyone isn't trying to be competitive about everything. "OMG my guild is teh best", that's already bad enough when there's NO pvp involved ;)

Of course those are just generalizations, but they fit in here I guess. /angry

Anyway, there is plenty of pvp on Lothar, and lots of 'organized' things (raids on astraanar, battles in hillsbrad). I'm looking forward to battlegrounds and raids in capitol cities. I'd rather be defending/attacking something big than running around hunting noobs.

Unless they make it so you can attack opposing faction anywhere and not just contested zones, the difference in servers probably isn't as big as you think.
Author:  Tooyooo [ Tue Dec 28, 2004 12:21 am ]
Post subject: 
side note... omg festaru ur on Lothar?

A bunch of us are on Lothar too.... drop us a line :)

My char name is "Tooyoo"
Author:  Dinav [ Tue Dec 28, 2004 2:08 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
) they wanted to choose when to pvp and when not to, but not to avoid it completely, they want to enjoy the game and mind their own business without a group of 13 year-olds who think they are the l33test because they ph4tpwnzored you when you're 5 levels lower than them and by yourself, all the time.

and 2) the general community is usually more mature when everyone isn't trying to be competitive about everything. "OMG my guild is teh best", that's already bad enough when there's NO pvp involved


1) But do they really? Is that really how the game was meant to be played? The game *is* world of warcraft, not "world of wait-5-minutes-I'm-doing-a-quest-craft". It isn't like FFXI where the lack of PvP was associated with a common alliegance and respect even though they all hated each other. I've never *truly* cared about being ganked ever. I normally laugh when it does happen, and I enjoy the strategy of actually doing it. That said, here's my "dinav is an asshole story":

Today I was passing through a little horde questing town where they kill plague'd alliance guys, etc in Arathi. So I walk in thinking I'm just going to impede a little leveling and then leave. I see a level 31 shaman, hunter, and mage. Thus, I realize I will get beat, being even 10 levels higher there's a good chance I'll lose. So I wait...and watch...as they kill a few guys then move to the 2nd floor...to kill the boss. shaman went in first, while mage and hunter rested...but the boss apparently summoned protectors(or there were pops...or they were stupid), and then the mage took hits and was at half health with full mp. Killing time.

Cold Blood > Ambush instantly killed the mage, then I just Vanished. The other 2 looked back for a second but I was stealthed by then. Ambush on the shaman took him out instantly as well. Now every mob in the room was on this hunter, as was I...and he ran...2 feet then dropped.

And that was my "ganking lowbies" story of the day. Most of my stories are of me 1-hitting warlocks for fun in BB though v_v.

2) Personally I enjoy being able to settle things with duels. If someone aggrivates me, I beat them to 1hp and leave them laughing. It means nothing, etc. but it makes me happier to destroy someone who pisses me off.
Author:  Yarr [ Tue Dec 28, 2004 10:10 am ]
Post subject: 
In daoc I loved people who had over powered classes (like old Zerkers) and would 2 shot me and brag on the boards about it. Like it was their leet skills that made them hit me for 600+ both times.

Becauce the way jobs/classes are designed, pvp will never prove to be a valid way of showing who is better. That is unless both jobs have identical stats, items and level and they 1v1.
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